What do you think about feminism, which tried to free women from some of these binds by fighting for them to have an equal place in the workplace and at home?

I think that what we're talking about is a reworking of feminism in the sense that we are opting to stay home and at the same time we are yelling from the treetops that this should not be something that makes us any less of a person in society. That's the part that upsets us the most. Have you ever read that book "The Mists of Avalon" [Marion Zimmer Bradley's gyno-centric reimagining of Arthurian legend]?

Yes, a long time ago.

Well, at some point the women were the powerful ones; we had all the power and the glory. Then it shifted and it was the men on top. And feminism tried to move us forward again, to get the same pay and the same promotions, and that's great and all, but sometimes ... feminism says, "OK, get that job," and "You can do just as good as the men," so we think, "OK, I've got to get that job and do just as good as the men but when I come home I've also got to be on duty." And doing it all is just not always possible.

There is a maternal instinct and I believe it is a biological thing. If you're going to try to work 60 hours a week and be a mother, you cannot do it all equally well. You have to make the choice as to what you want and what your priority is. It's a reworking of feminism because if stay-at-home moms had respect like they do in the workplace it wouldn't be so much of an issue. That's why we came up with the title CHO for chief household officer. Because when you lose your paycheck and lose your title, somehow you lose respect. And we are trying to explain why that should not be the case. When you tell people you're staying home, they should say "Congratulations! What a great choice!"

But have people who answer that they work made a bad choice?

No, but workplaces should have on-site day care and let you work flexible hours. Can you imagine? We need this reinvention. Look what's happened by not putting the family first.

What's happened?

It seems like there's a lot more weird stuff going on in society than there used to be.

Are you blaming the weird stuff on the feminist movement?

No, not really. But you've got a lot of moms who tried to have it all and you're seeing the results of that in that children were not getting as much dedicated attention as they were before when you had June Cleavers. I heard on TV recently that kids in grade school were giving oral sex to people for a dollar. I don't know if that went on in the 1950s but I sure didn't hear about it. I wasn't around in the '50s but you know what I mean. Why is that happening now?

It sounds like you're idealizing the 1950s, which is pretty controversial. The 1950s was a stifling decade for women. Do you want to go back to the '50s?

No, I think that somewhere between the 1950s and now, that's the happy medium we're trying to get to now. If we could have the liberation but still put family first.

What would be interesting is to see if you took finances completely out of the picture what women's choice would be. Is the need for dual incomes the main reason they're not staying home? Or are they not staying home because they'd rather work?

Well, why did you choose to start this magazine?

We realized that there was no magazine that spoke to women in the voice that we as professional women turned stay-at-home moms wanted to read. Most other magazines are very advice- and tip-driven: trim down your abs, et cetera. Just reading the cover you [get the message that you're] not good enough the way you are. When you go out with your girlfriend, she tells you, "Oh, you're going through this difficult time, I understand." That's the voice we wanted to capture.

So you didn't choose to found the magazine for financial reasons, but because you were passionate about it.

Absolutely. And that's part of our thinking. That if women decided to be at home, they might get involved in [projects they're passionate about]. I am very, very thankful my husband goes out and gets his paycheck and keeps the house afloat. I am very, very thankful that I have the opportunity to do something I really care about. It's a way to keep the adult side of yourself as passionate and alive as the side of you that's playing Barbies. You're having the best of both worlds and your brain is not turning to mush.

I remember my husband getting home one night and suggesting we get pizza. And I took down the phone book and started counting the places we could order from: "One, two, three, four, five ..." and he said, "You don't have to count like that to me." So you don't want to stay like that all the time, because, yeah, you would go crazy.

Is there one moment when you remember knowing for sure that you did the right thing by staying home?

When one of my daughters was starting to walk, I was right there and I didn't have to hear about it from a day-care person. It was like, "Here it is, the first time, and I'm sitting right here and I'm never going to forget this." Stay-at-home moms cry on a regular basis, because we are filled with joy and frustration. And when you become a stay-at-home mom, you really join a community of women.

It's not scary, really.

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